BDD 189 – New Daemons of Chaos Rumours Round-up

new Daemons of Chaos

New Daemons of Chaos Rumour Round-up

Today I am talking about the New Daemons of Chaos Rumours that have ben all over the forums and social networks this week.

Photos from the next issue of White Dwarf have been leaked and are all over sites like Warseer, The Warhammer Forum and the Plastic Krak blog.  These same websites also have rumoured rules from the release.

All pics from Fields Of Blood Blog. 

Rumoured Rules spotted so far, all curtosy of fields of blood

Bloodletters of Khorne are now strength 4, with special rules MR1, Scaly skin 6+, Daemonic and Daemon of Khorne. They have the daemonic gift Hellblade…. 14 points

I cant see any reference to killing blow but that dosnt mean they loose it as the sword may grant it.

Pink Horrors stats stay the same, special rules are Daemonic, Daemon of Tzeentch, Blue horrors of Tzeentch, and a unit counts as a level 1 caster…. 13 points

Yay Blue horrors of Tzeentch. No idea how it works but yay!

Plaugebearers are strength 4 Toughness 4, have the Daemonic gift plaguesword, and are Daemons of Nurgle, and Daemonic…. 13 points

Daemonettes get 2 attacks, and become Daemons of Slannesh + Daemonic for 11 points

Bloodcrushers are now special, 3+ a unit, the jugger mounts get toughness 4 and 3 wounds like the WOC ones, and are 65 points. With the scaly skin rules Daemons now have a 3+ 5++ save monstrous cav option!

Flamers appear to have the same stats as the WD rules, and are 40 points. Special rules flames of Tzeentch, Daemons of Tzeentch, Warpflame, Daemonic and skirmishers.

There appears to be an option to upgrade a unit of Plaguebearers to have regenerate, and another option that if you score any roll of 6 to hit with a  poisonattack, an additional strength 4 hit is made. Another option is upgrading poison to 5+

My thoughts on these, if they prove to be true:

  • Bloodletters look right if Hellblade gives KB. Scaly Skin is a bit of a red herring. The drop in Str and 2 pt increase rebalance things.

  • Don’t understand Horror rules. Are Pink Horrors still caster?

  • Not sure why you wouldn’t take Plaguebearers over Bloodletters –  1 pt increase for +1 Str – yes please

  • The Bloodcrushers have worse rider than Skullcrushers, but are 13 pts cheaper and have 5+ Ward


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BDD 159 – Tactics Against Siren Song

Siren Song

Tactics Against Siren Song

In this episode I am taking a look at some tactics that you can employ when facing Daemons of Chaos with Siren Song.  These can also be put to use against the Master Rune Of Challenge found in the Dwarf army.

First, lets take a look at the actual Siren Song rules as found on Page 94 of the Daemons of Chaos army book.

Siren Song

One Use Only.  This Gift is used once during the enemy turn, before charges are declared. Nominate one enemy within 20″ of the Daemon – this unit must be able to charge according to the normal Warhammer rules.  The target must either declare a charge against the Daemon (or the unit it is with) or immediately flee, exactly as if it had failed a Panic test.

My tactic’s for facing Siren Song are below.  These are only the summaries, listen to the episode for a more in depth explanation.

1. Keep your eye on the ball.

The most common problem that players have is simply forgetting about the fact that your opponent may have this option up his sleeve.  Its an out of sequence action that is not seen too often and in some cases you might never face it unless a local member of your gaming group is using it.  You should write it down at the start of the game.  Writing things down always helps you to remember them later.  It is important to think about what could happen in the following turn if the Siren moves and where it could end up.   Check the possible places that the Siren could finish it’s movement and base your turn with that posibility in mind.  Its also essential that you think about this during deployment.  The last thing you want is to remember about Siren Song just after your opponent has won the roll for turn 1 and put you in a bad position.

2. Your going to have to charge so…

You get the option to flee from Siren Song but often you will be in a position where that is not an option.  To get around this you have to make sure that when you charge it is on your terms.  My Dark Elf Dragon used to enjoy charging the Daemonette unit along with a hydra and 2 chariots.  A good Daemon player will try to use his support to stop this happening, you can use the other tips in this episode to delay the combat until it is on your terms.

3. Flee to safety.  

Fleeing is an option, but its not always as safe as it appears.  Beware of furies lurking with a 22″ range of forcing you to flee again.  You should try to flee through a friendly unit to make sure you get away.

4. Turn around

Turn vulnerable units around.  It’s pretty simple but effective.  Try not to leave yourself out of position.

5. Stack them up.

Positioning one unit in front of another to protect the rear unit from declaring a charge is another good way of limiting what the siren song can do.

6. Death Magic.

You can use Death Magic to kill the Slaanesh Herald before you get pulled in.  Just be aware that 24″ range is awfully short when you have a whole Daemon army running at you

7. Charge another unit in the way

This one is tricky to set up and also situational.  There are no rules governing the order in which you move your chargers when it come to siren song.  You must declare the Siren charge first, but since 8th edition was released, moving chargers is a totally separate to the order that you declared them.  You could have a friendly unit complete or fail a charge and block the charge path of the siren song unit.  This is difficult to pull off, but its worth knowing and having in your back pocket when needed.

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BDD 132 – Top 5 New Zealand Masters Lists

New Zealand Masters

Top 5 New Zealand Masters Lists

Today I am talking about the New Zealand Masters.  I’ll have a run down of the rulespack and give my top 5 lists at the tournament.

Just to be clear, I have not idea about the final ranking places going into this event, who are the favourites or anything about the New Zealand Warhammer Communits other than having met a few of the guys at the ETC and the ones who have travelled to the UK and having spoken on email and twitter to some of the players.  I’m basing my top 5 on lists alone having reviewed the lists and read the rules pack.

So first I’ll cover the rules pack.

Its 6 games of Warhammer at 2400 points.  the Scoring system is 20-0 with staggered bandings, starting at 100 point increments and varying as it goes up.  Battle points account for 60% of the overall score. The remaining 40% is governed by sportsmanship.  5 points are avaliable per game.  you mark your player 0, 3 or 5.  5 being a generally good game, this is the score for an average game.  3 is giving for shenanigans, and 0 for a complete disadte.

The Scenarios are all 6 from the rulebook.  The composition system being used looks to be the 2012 South Coast GT rules pack but I did not check for an exact match.

Lets get onto the lists;

5.  Orcs and Goblins.

Big Savage Orcs, Big Trolls.  2 Warbosses. Its still go the Doom Diver and a Stone thrower and also has a bunch of chariots.  It should go well against the Empire,

4. Vampire Counts

This Vampire list is an odd one but even with a small knight unit I think it has the potential for a few big wins and to play tight and take what points it can in the tougher games.  There is not a huge amount of armies that can deal with the lord so his is going to have a field day in some games.

3. Empire

This is a solid Empire list, everything about it says that its going to be hard to get points from the list other than the fact that I think the player may have misjudged his competition when he decided to go for metal magic.  If he brought Light (or even Fire) on the lv4 I woulld say it was the best list at the Tournament, but i’m not sure it has enough in the list to beat the Deamons and Skaven.

2. Deamons of Chaos

I like this Deamon list, especially in the  light of what the other players have brought.  This player clearly expected to face Ogres and Empire with the Balesword Great Unclean one and Metal Master of Sorcery.  The Screaming Bell Skaven will still destroy this list without breaking sweat but everything else will have a lot of problems.

1. Skaven.

It looks like a Ben Johnson Screaming Bell build before he dropped the gutter runners for the Assassins.  In this environment the Bell has little to fear from the rest of the field other than possibly the empire with 2 cannons, even then 18 gutter runners, a cannon, and a storm banner should  see it through.  Even if that game goes badly, I think that over the 6 games this Skaven list will pick up more big wins than the Empire.


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BDD 130 – Lore of Death and Leadership Combos

Lore of Death and Leadership Combos

In this episode I am going to talk about some combinations that can take advantage of the Lore of Death and the Unmodified Leadership FAQ that I talked about yesterday.

These combinations are usually pretty good regardless of the fact that Spirit Leech can benefit from them too, so even if the FAQ gets amended in the future I hope that these combos will still be potent.

Deamons of Chaos – The Slaanesh Leadership Bomb.

This army build lost a lot of its power when Terror was reduced from a 6″ bubble to only working while charging.  The army is still a good option though and I think you can make a few tweeks to get it working.  I would start off by including 2 Tzeench Heralds both running Master of Sorcery and the Lore of Death.  This gives you 2 attempts at Doom and Darkness and Spirit Leech.  I would make one of them a winged horror and the BSB and give him the greater Icon of Despair.  This item is one of the most powerful items in Warhammer and it really is a mystery to me why it is seldom used.  Maybe some Daemon player can enlighten me.

I will include the Masque of Slannesh for her ability to lower leadership by a further D3.  You have just enough points left to fit in a Khorne Herald too.

The rest of the list would be 2 Bloodletter Hordes to fill the core and some horrors to baby sit the Hearalds.  Finally I would want some high impact unit that can run in and win a combat by a small amount.  The chariots of great for this as they are very cheap.  It would be nice to get a SoulGrinder too but the army becomes very small at that point.  saying that, the flame cannon alone could win games with this build.

Warriors of Chaos Doom Totem and Hellcannons.

The Warriors version of the Leadership Bomb list throws out some interesting options.  The clear auto-includes are the 2 Hellcannons and the Doom Totem BSB.  After that you have a few options.  The obvious ones are a Tzeench Lord on Disc with diabloic Spledour.  I would give him a 3+ Ward and have he harassing units never getting into combat.  You can even get the Bloodcurdling Roar if you forgo a magic weapon.

This in combination with a dath wizard can mage for some -6 leadership tests from the Hellcannons. Pretty Scary!

What I would do is run a slightly different version with a Slannesh Lv4 and a Death lv4 instead of the Chaos Lord.  You can fit them both in under 600 points and the Slaanesh Warriors magic is very fun to use.  Spells like Titillating Delusions and Hellshriek are game winning.

Tomb Kings Skulls and Caskets

The Tomb Kings can build a very nasty Death list and while it doesn’t need special characters to do it, I can hardly pass up the oppertunity to include Arkan the Black.

Arkan can be your armys Heirphant and also use Death magic, this save you the trouble of investing in a seperate model to fill that role.  He is also lv5 Wizard and can store your dispel dice to use as power dice in the following phase.  You can also fit in A tomb King to get that Leadership 10 Spirit Leech and then add in a couple of lv1’s on Death to get a few more attempt at the spell.  Rare Choices are 2 Screaming Skull Catapults and at least 1 Casket of Souls, then you choose between the Hierotitan or the 2nd Casket.  Both are good choices.  I would finish the list with Ramhotep and a huge unit of Necropolis Knights then add core to your tastes.


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Daily Episode 96 – Nick Pym talks Daemons of Chaos

Nick Pym talks Daemons of Chaos

In this episode I grab a chat with Nick Pym.  Nick is currently the top form guy in the UK.  Ben Johnson is holding him off for 1st place in the rankings but even Ben has not matched Nicks 5, 2 day, tournament wins in the last 12 months.  We chat about Daemons of Chaos, how he has played them to death to find the best list combinations and what units work best for him including some very interesting builds.  He give a great answer to the regular ‘What is Chaff’ question and has a in-depth run down of the Chaff in his army and how he puts it to good use.


I announce a competition that is running between episode 100 and 101. Team England are giving away their winning from the ETC so listen this week to find out how to be in with a chance of winning over 100 euros worth of prizes.

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Daily Episode 54 – Daemons of Chaos Rules Update

Bad Dice Daily

Daily Episode 54 – Daemons of Chaos Rules Update

I have a rundown of all the rules changes that were published in White Dwarf issue 392.  New Rules for Flamers and Screamers of Tzeentch and new unit entries in the form of the Soulgrinders, the Seeker Chariot of Slaanesh, Exalted Seeker Chariot of Slaanesh and Hellflayers of Slaanesh.

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